标题: 妄图抹黑中医的人们，我们来聊聊针灸吧 [打印本页]
作者: raiseyu 时间: 2011-6-2 23:04 标题: 妄图抹黑中医的人们，我们来聊聊针灸吧
对于针灸，有什么文章或是说法，我们来聊聊
作者: dwyqrm 时间: 2011-6-2 23:24
转帖：
文：MVARXER
中医里讲：“病来如山倒，病去如抽丝。”一是因为中医不知道有急性病和慢性病的区别，二是中药从来没有立竿见影的效果。一副中药开下去，先吃个一两个月，没效果？再吃个一年两年、还没效果？换几味药试试？还不行？那是你点背没遇到神医？神医在哪？额，他们德高望重、超凡脱俗，大多归隐山林了。病人这番治疗下来，或是病情恶化最后住了西医院，或是还能撑的继续找名医，也间或碰上几个自愈的，那一个神医就蛋生了。
如此这般，中医怎么都难有说服力。就是中医粉自己心里也没底，不过他们还有杀手锏，那就是针灸。你说中医看不到效果？咱针灸立杆见影？你说没有穴位？咱针灸就是证明！
针灸真的这么神奇吗？那我们来看看针灸的真实面目吧！
1、针灸不神奇，刺激细胞产生止痛物质。
针灸的原理是针刺破细胞而使其产生了一种止痛的物质。受过伤的人都有一种经验，那就是受伤的一刻是最最痛的，稍后即使很痛也比最初的痛弱了很多。这就是人体的细胞损害后释放了大量的这类止痛物质。显然伤口还在，不会马上愈合。
类似的经验还有很多：
感冒头痛了，会让别人在额头上恰出一排紫红的印子来缓解疼痛。
背痛、腰痛了锤锤会舒服些。
强烈的头痛病人甚至会用头撞墙减缓疼痛。（我承认针灸比撞墙好）
还有什么按摩、刮痧、拔罐类的，
其实都是一个原理。刺激细胞产生止痛物质。
而针灸的好处在于：一是它的针很细对细胞不会造成太大的伤害；二是针灸的深度较深，刺激深层的细胞能释放出更多的止痛物质。
（我个人也常做针灸，对他的止痛效果我还是推崇的。）
2、针灸止痛，但并不治病。（至少多数情况如此。）
其实知道了针灸的原理得出这个结论就很正常了。事实上也是如此，我所去的医院里就常见很多人针灸，有颈椎病、腰锥、脊柱、关节炎等等的病人，都是痛了就针两天，过几天再痛再针，好多都是老面孔，没见谁靠针灸治好的。
中医里有说法：“通则不痛、痛则不通。”现在看来很可笑，我们都知道，止痛药吃了不治病。病了会痛，但不痛不代表病就好了。
有人说我脖子拧了，针一下就好了。那是因为针灸止痛的同时你自身的修复系统完成了修复。这种不是器质性损害，你要是挺几天自己也能好。（当然针一下少受罪也不耽误工作生活还是挺好的。）
3、经脉、穴位纯扯淡。
显然，知道了针灸的效果原理。再想想穴位就知道有多可笑了。穴位的诞生无非是古人发现了有些特定的部位扎起来止痛效果更好。
有人说不认穴位你乱扎试试？乱扎肯定不行！要避开血管、神经、骨头，还必须是有经验的人来扎，但绝不是因为什么穴位。
经脉、穴位不是号称人体开关吗？什么这个穴位通胃、那个穴位主肝的。你到正规医院针灸的地方看看，都是哪痛针哪儿。没看头痛针脚的。可见所谓穴位纯是无稽之谈。
结束语：
针灸很伟大，但它并不神奇。
祖先很伟大，但祖先崇拜很可怕。
在祖先身上寻找荣耀是一种无能的表现。
迷恋于历史的民族没有未来！
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下面是国外对针灸的研究报告：（很遗憾，又是外国人，中国的专家都在忙学习易经、内经中……）
英国《自然·神经科学》杂志刊登报告说，美国罗彻斯特大学等机构的研究人员通过动物实验发现了这一原理。他们对有一只爪子不舒服的实验鼠的相应膝盖部位进行约半小时的针灸，结果发现这会导致实验鼠机体释放一种名为腺苷的物质，这种物质具有天然的止痛效果，可以减轻实验鼠的疼痛。检测显示，针灸后相应部位腺苷的含量是针灸前的24倍以上。
下面是原文：
Nature Neuroscience (2010) doi:10.1038/nn.2562
Adenosine A1 receptors mediate local anti-nociceptive effects of acupunctureNanna Goldman,Michael Chen,Takumi Fujita,Qiwu Xu,Weiguo Peng,Wei Liu,Tina K Jensen,Yong Pei,Fushun Wang,Xiaoning Han,Jiang-Fan Chen,Jurgen Schnermann,Takahiro Takano,Lane Bekar,Kim Tieu& Maiken Nedergaard
Acupuncture is an invasive procedure commonly used to relieve pain. Acupuncture is practiced worldwide, despite difficulties in reconciling its principles with evidence-based medicine. We found that adenosine, a neuromodulator with anti-nociceptive properties, was released during acupuncture in mice and that its anti-nociceptive actions required adenosine A1 receptor expression. Direct injection of an adenosine A1 receptor agonist replicated the analgesic effect of acupuncture. Inhibition of enzymes involved in adenosine degradation potentiated the acupuncture-elicited increase in adenosine, as well as its anti-nociceptive effect. These observations indicate that adenosine mediates the effects of acupuncture and that interfering with adenosine metabolism may prolong the clinical benefit of acupuncture.
作者: citycamel 时间: 2011-6-2 23:25
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作者: 一大 时间: 2011-6-2 23:25
支持中医！
作者: dwyqrm 时间: 2011-6-2 23:35
转帖：
题目：警惕针灸，气功 , 和 中医
作者: 美国史蒂芬巴雷特, 医学博士 2004年1月29日
“中医，” 时常叫做“东方医药” 或者“传统的中国医药 (TCM)，” 包含无数以神秘为基础的民间医学实践的内容。 据说，身体的重要能量 (气) 循环在叫做经络的通道内。经络分支连接身体的器官和功能。 疾病被归因于气的不平衡或中断。 古老的中医实践 , 像是针灸，气功 , 和各种不同草药的使用（的原理）被说成是能回复这种平衡。
Be Wary of Acupuncture, Qigong, and "Chinese Medicine"
Stephen Barrett, M.D.
"Chinese medicine," often called "Oriental medicine" or "traditional Chinese medicine (TCM)," encompasses a vast array of folk medical practices based on mysticism. It holds that the body's vital energy (chi or qi) circulates through channels, called meridians, that have branches connected to bodily organs and functions. Illness is attributed to imbalance or interruption of chi. Ancient practices such as acupuncture, Qigong, and the use of various herbs are claimed to restore balance.
针灸术是用不锈钢针插入身体的各个部分。在针上加低频电流能够产生更大的刺激。 其它的中医方法也可以和针灸一起用或分开用，包括: 艾灸 (置放在皮肤表面并燃烧的棉和草药); 通过插入的针注入蒸馏水，普鲁卡因，吗啡，维生素或顺势疗法液; 使用激光; 耳针; 穴位指压 (acupressure)。 针灸的针要插在被认为遍布全身的 “穴位”上 。 本来有 365 个穴位, 应对一年有365天。 但是在过去 2,000 年期间被针灸倡议者新发现的穴位数字已经逐渐地增加到大约 2,000个[1]. 治疗时所选的穴位有些是在疾病位置的附近，而有些则根据症状而定。 在传统的针灸中，通常使用多穴位的组合。
Traditional acupuncture, as now practiced, involves the insertion of stainless steel needles into various body areas. A low-frequency current may be applied to the needles to produce greater stimulation. Other procedures used separately or together with acupuncture include: moxibustion (burning of floss or herbs applied to the skin); injection of sterile water, procaine, morphine, vitamins, or homeopathic solutions through the inserted needles; applications of laser beams (laserpuncture); placement of needles in the external ear (auriculotherapy); and acupressure (use of manual pressure). Treatment is applied to "acupuncture points," which are said to be located throughout the body. Originally there were 365 such points, corresponding to the days of the year, but the number identified by proponents during the past 2,000 years has increased gradually to about 2,000 [1]. Some practitioners place needles at or near the site of disease, whereas others select points on the basis of symptoms. In traditional acupuncture, a combination of points is usually used.
气功也被认为能影响“生命能量（气）”的流动。 内气功包括自己做的深呼吸，思想集中和放松技术。外气功由气功师表演，这些人说从他们的指尖释放的能源能治疗各种疾病。 然而，中国的科学家们并没有发现气功师的超自然的力量，反倒发现了一些欺骗的证据。例如，科学家发现, 当一个气功师有节奏地移动他的手的时候，距他有8英尺远的躺在检查床的一位病人会随着气功师的手的移动而同一节奏地扭动身体。但是如果把病人放在气功师看不到的地方，就没有了这样的两人同节奏关系。 [2].
Qigong is also claimed to influence the flow of "vital energy." Internal Qigong involves deep breathing, concentration, and relaxation techniques used by individuals for themselves. External Qigong is performed by "Qigong masters" who claim to cure a wide variety of diseases with energy released from their fingertips. However, scientific investigators of Qigong masters in China have found no evidence of paranormal powers and some evidence of deception. They found, for example, that a patient lying on a table about eight feet from a Qigong master moved rhythmically or thrashed about as the master moved his hands. But when she was placed so that she could no longer see him, her movements were unrelated to his [2]. Falun gong, which China recently banned, is a Qigong varient claimed to be "a powerful mechanism for healing, stress relief and health improvements."
大多数针灸师支持传统中医对健康和疾病的说法，认为针灸，草药和其它中医方法对人类的各种疾病都有效。而其他人认为中医治病的方法是无效的，他们仅仅接受针灸作为止痛用的简单手段。中医的诊断过程包括询问 (病史, 生活方式), 观察 (皮肤，舌, 颜色), 听 (呼吸音), 和把脉。 据说与身体器官和功能有关的六种（腕部）脉象能够确定那一个经络有气虚。而现代医学只知道因心跳而产生的只有一种脉搏。这种脉搏可在手腕，脖子，脚和身体不同部位被触摸到。 一些针灸师认为症状出现之前几个星期或几个月病人体内已经有“电的不平衡”，他们认为针灸可以治疗疾病显露之前的“不适”。
Most acupuncturists espouse the traditional Chinese view of health and disease and consider acupuncture, herbal medicine, and related practices to be valid approaches to the full gamut of disease. Others reject the traditional approach and merely claim that acupuncture offers a simple way to achieve pain relief. The diagnostic process used by TCM practitioners may include questioning (medical history, lifestyle), observations (skin, tongue, color), listening (breathing sounds), and pulse-taking. Six pulse aspects said to correlate with body organs or functions are checked on each wrist to determine which meridians are "deficient" in chi. (Medical science recognizes only one pulse, corresponding to the heartbeat, which can be felt in the wrist, neck, feet, and various other places.) Some acupuncturists state that the electrical properties of the body may become imbalanced weeks or even months before symptoms occur. These practitioners claim that acupuncture can be used to treat conditions when the patient just "doesn't feel right," even though no disease is apparent.
中国的中医和亚洲国家的其它民间医对某些动物造成威胁。 比如，要取黑熊的胆汁（囊），黑熊在亚洲几乎绝迹。在北美偷猎黑熊的问题越来越大。
TCM (as well as the folk medical practices of various other Asian countries) is a threat to certain animal species. For example, black bears—valued for their gall bladders—have been hunted nearly to extinction in Asia, and poaching of black bears is a growing problem in North America.
可疑的说法：
针灸据说对以下疾病有效：慢性疼痛 (颈痛，背痛, 偏头痛) ，急性损伤 (扭伤， 肌肉韧带撕裂) ， 胃肠道疾病 (消化不良，溃疡，便秘, 腹泻) ，心血管疾病 (高血压和低血压) ，泌尿生殖器疾病 (月经不调，性冷淡, 阳痿), 肌肉和神经疾病 (瘫痪,耳聋), 和行为疾病(过食，药物依赖, 抽菸)。然而，有效的说法大多来自中医的主观观察和设计极不严格的研究结果。
一项设有对照的研究发现在治疗慢性疼痛方面，耳朵的电针和轻触样的假治效果是一样的。[3]. 1990 年，三个荷兰流行病学专家分析了 51个设有对照组的针灸治疗慢性疼痛的研究，结论是：在这51个报告中，那些看上去质量好一些的研究也是二流水平。针灸治疗慢性疼痛的效能可疑。[4] 他们也调查了针灸治疗香烟，海洛英和酒精上瘾的报告，结论是：完善的临床研究不支持这些报告中针灸有效的说法 [5].
Dubious Claims
The conditions claimed to respond to acupuncture include chronic pain (neck and back pain, migraine headaches), acute injury-related pain (strains, muscle and ligament tears), gastrointestinal problems (indigestion, ulcers, constipation, diarrhea), cardiovascular conditions (high and low blood pressure), genitourinary problems (menstrual irregularity, frigidity, impotence), muscle and nerve conditions (paralysis, deafness), and behavioral problems (overeating, drug dependence, smoking). However, the evidence supporting these claims consists mostly of practitioners' observations and poorly designed studies. A controlled study found that electroacupuncture of the ear was no more effective than placebo stimulation (light touching) against chronic pain [3]. In 1990, three Dutch epidemiologists analyzed 51 controlled studies of acupuncture for chronic pain and concluded that "the quality of even the better studies proved to be mediocre. . . . The efficacy of acupuncture in the treatment of chronic pain remains doubtful." [4] They also examined reports of acupuncture used to treat addictions to cigarettes, heroin, and alcohol, and concluded that claims that acupuncture is effective as a therapy for these conditions are not supported by sound clinical research [5].
在东方国家（中国），外科手术并不总是使用针灸麻醉。不像它的倡议者期待得那样多。 中国医师做针麻的时候要筛选病人，把自己认为不合适的病人除名。 针灸也不作为急症的手术用。而且时常和局部麻醉药或镇痛药并用。[6].
针灸如何减痛的原因是不清楚的。 一个理论说针灸通过“门控”阻断了痛苦的神经冲动而使它不能传播到脊髓或大脑。 另外的一个理论说针灸刺激身体能生产有镇痛作用的物质叫 endorphins, 它能减少疼痛。 其它的理论说针灸的（假治）安慰剂效果，暗示 (催眠)效果和文化灌输的效果是主要原因。 Melzack 和 Wall注意到其它过度刺激的方法也能产生和针灸同样的效果，比如电和热对穴位和非穴位的刺激。因此，他们得出结论说：“包括针灸在内的不同形式的刺激达到相同的结果就说明了针灸不是一个有神奇力量的东西。针灸是能够造成较强的感觉神经刺激从而产生止痛效果的众多方法之一。” 1981 年，美国医学会的科学委员会注意到，针灸对大多数病人的止痛作用的一致性和重复性很差，并且对有些病人完全无效。 [7].
Acupuncture anesthesia is not used for surgery in the Orient to the extent that its proponents suggest. In China physicians screen out patients who appear to be unsuitable. Acupuncture is not used for emergency surgery and often is accompanied by local anesthesia or narcotic medication [6].
How acupuncture may relieve pain is unclear. One theory suggests that pain impulses are blocked from reaching the spinal cord or brain at various "gates" to these areas. Another theory suggests that acupuncture stimulates the body to produce narcotic-like substances called endorphins, which reduce pain. Other theories suggest that the placebo effect, external suggestion (hypnosis), and cultural conditioning are important factors. Melzack and Wall note that pain relief produced by acupuncture can also be produced by many other types of sensory hyperstimulation, such as electricity and heat at acupuncture points and elsewhere in the body. They conclude that "the effectiveness of all of these forms of stimulation indicates that acupuncture is not a magical procedure but only one of many ways to produce analgesia [pain relief] by an intense sensory input." In 1981, the American Medical Association Council on Scientific Affairs noted that pain relief does not occur consistently or reproducibly in most people and does not operate at all in some people [7].
1995 年, 密苏里州大学医学院精神病学的临床教授George A. Ulett 博士说：“如果不理会针灸超自然的想法，那么针灸只是一个简单的，有用的，非药物的镇痛方法。” 他相信传统针灸（中医）的各种方法基本就是安慰治疗, 但是大约有 80个穴位的电刺激方法已经被证明有镇痛作用 [8].
In 1995, George A. Ulett, M.D., Ph.D., Clinical Professor of Psychiatry, University of Missouri School of Medicine, stated that "devoid of metaphysical thinking, acupuncture becomes a rather simple technique that can be useful as a nondrug method of pain control." He believes that the traditional Chinese variety is primarily a placebo treatment, but electrical stimulation of about 80 acupuncture points has been proven useful for pain control [8].
在中国，中医研究的质量极差。 最近一项针对中国医学杂志刊登的2,938项临床实验的分析表明：绝大部分临床实验都（因为质量不合格而）不能做出（他们已经做出）的结论。分析人员说：大多数中医临床试验中, 疾病的定义和诊断来自于现代医学，试验的结果用现代医学的客观方法或主观方法，或两者同时都用的方法评估, 最后，又要塞进中医的方法。 在非专科杂志中，90% 以上的临床试验都是在评估中草药的疗效，这样的治疗就是大多数中药的临床现状。
The quality of TCM research in China has been extremely poor. A recent analysis of 2,938 reports of clinical trials reported in Chinese medical journals concluded that that no conclusions could be drawn from the vast majority of them. The researchers stated: In most of the trials, disease was defined and diagnosed according to conventional medicine; trial outcomes were assessed with objective or subjective (or both) methods of conventional medicine, often complemented by traditional Chinese methods. Over 90% of the trials in non-specialist journals evaluated herbal treatments that were mostly proprietary Chinese medicines. . . .
虽然科学研究的方法学的质量多年来一直在改进，但是（中医临床研究）还是有很多问题。 随机化的方法不正确。“盲法”只用于 15% 的临床报告。 很少有几个临床试多过 300个病人。很多临床试验把另一个中药作为对照组。可是，那个作为对照组的中药并没有（事先）被随机对照实验检查过。 大多数的试验只有短期的或中间期的报告，而没有长期的结果。 大多数的试验没有随访的数据。中药的效果被表达和报告的时候也极少用“量”的形式。一半之上临床实验没有报告基线数据或副作用数据。 很多实验作为短文发表。 大多数实验都说（中药）治疗是有效的,这说明出版者的不公正性（偏爱）非常普遍; 对于49个有阳性结果的针灸治疗中风的临床实验报告，有人再作文献统计学“漏斗形”检验，结果证明针灸和对照组的效果一样。[9]
Although methodological quality has been improving over the years, many problems remain. The method of randomisation was often inappropriately described. Blinding was used in only 15% of trials. Only a few studies had sample sizes of 300 subjects or more. Many trials used as a control another Chinese medicine treatment whose effectiveness had often not been evaluated by randomised controlled trials. Most trials focused on short term or intermediate rather than long term outcomes. Most trials did not report data on compliance and completeness of follow up. Effectiveness was rarely quantitatively expressed and reported. Intention to treat analysis was never mentioned. Over half did not report data on baseline characteristics or on side effects. Many trials were published as short reports. Most trials claimed that the tested treatments were effective, indicating that publication bias may be common; a funnel plot of the 49 trials of acupuncture in the treatment of stroke confirmed selective publication of positive trials in the area, suggesting that acupuncture may not be more effective than the control treatments. [9]
（英文专门解释：什么是漏斗形检验？Funnel plots are a visual tool for investigating publication and other bias in meta-analysis. They are simple scatterplots of the treatment effects estimated from individual studies (horizontal axis) against a measure of study size (vertical axis). The name "funnel plot" is based on the precision in the estimation of the underlying treatment effect increasing as the sample size of component studies increases. Therefore, in the absence of bias, results from small studies will scatter widely at the bottom of the graph, with the spread narrowing among larger studies. Publication bias (the association of publication probability with the statistical significance of study results) may lead to asymmetrical funnel plots. It is, however, important to realize that publication bias is only one of a number of possible causes of funnel-plot asymmetry-funnel plots should be seen as a generic means of examining small study effects (the tendency for the smaller studies in a meta-analysis to show larger treatment effects) rather than a tool to diagnose specific types of bias. This article introduces the metafunnel command, which produces funnel plots in Stata. In accordance with published recommendations, standard error is used as the measure of study size. Treatment effects expressed as ratio measures (for example risk ratios or odds ratios) may be plotted on a log scale.）
两位海德堡大学的科学家已经发明了针灸临床实验对照组用的“假针”，这就使针灸研究可以有设计得更好的对照组。 假针的顶端是钝头，在一个铜管里自由滑动。当顶端碰到皮肤的时候，病人会有被针灸的感觉。 同时，假针滑入铜管，从外面看好像进入皮肤，（其实没有穿透皮肤。） 当用假针测试志愿者的时候, 他们都以为针穿入了皮肤 [10].
2004 年，海德堡大学的研究人员证实了“假针”的对照作用。他们对乳房手术和妇科手术后的病人的恶心呕吐症状做了针灸治疗研究。 他们给220个手术后病人在前臂内侧的“心包 6号”穴位上应用针灸或者是“假针”。结论是针灸组和假针组没有不同。无论是对于麻醉前用了抗呕吐药的病人还是麻醉中用了抗呕吐药的病人，针灸组和假针组的效果也没有明显不同。 [11].同一个研究中的一个亚组统计学分析发现针灸能够“明显”减少病人呕吐，但是作者们解释说，这个现象可能是观察指标过多造成的。(当观察指标的数量增加时, “统计上的明显差异”的结论就越靠不住。其实这个实验（对我们大家来说）非常重要，因为针灸的抗呕吐效果是（迄今）科学文献上针灸被认定的很少的几个有效治疗之一。而其它有阳性结果的实验都没有很好的对照组。
Two scientists at the University of Heidelberg have developed a "fake needle" that may enable acupuncture researchers to perform better-designed controlled studies. The device is a needle with a blunt tip that moves freely within a copper handle. When the tip touches the skin, the patient feels a sensation similar to that of an acupuncture needle. At the same time, the visible part of the needle moves inside the handle so it appears to shorten as though penetrating the skin. When the device was tested on volunteers, none suspected that it had not penetrated the skin [10].
In 2004, a University of Heidelberg team proved the worth of their "sham acupuncture" technique in a study of postoperative nausea and vomiting (PONV) in women who underwent breast or gynecologic surgery. The study involved 220 women who received either acupuncture or the sham procedure at the acupuncture point "Pericardium 6" on the inside of the forearm. No significant difference in PONV or antivomiting medication use was found between the two groups or between the people who received treatment before anesthesia was induced and those who received it while anesthetized [11]. A subgroup analysis found that vomiting was "significantly reduced" among the acupuncture patients, but the authors correctly noted that this finding might be due to studying multiple outcomes. (As the number of different outcome measures increases, so do the odds that a "statistically significant" finding will be spurious.) This study is important because PONV reduction is one of the few alleged benefits of acupuncture supported by reports in scientific journals. However, the other positive studies were not as tightly controlled..
针灸的不良作用：
不正确地针灸操作能产生造成晕厥，刺破血管发生血肿，刺破肺出现气胸，抽搐，局部感染，没消毒的针传染肝炎 B，细菌性心内膜炎，接触性皮炎和神经损伤。 （美国）针灸师用的草药也没有针对其安全性，效力强度，或有效性进行管理。 一个针灸师给病人做诊断也存在风险，因为他们不用科学的知识做诊断，将会延误病人危重的情况。
针灸的不良作用可能与针灸师的训练有关。一项调查表明，挪威1,135个医师（用
针灸治疗后病人出现），66个局部感染，25个气胸，31个疼痛增加，80个其它并发症。 而对 197个（没有西医执照的）针灸师的平行调查发现,这些人的病例更容易产生即刻的并发症, 132个晕厥，26个增加疼痛，8个气胸，和 45个其它并发症。[12]. 然而，对日本的 76个针灸师 5 年的总结可以看到，针灸治疗的 55,591病例中，只有 64个不良反应。 其中包括16个遗留针和13个短暂低血压。 没有严重的并发症。研究人员认为，如果针灸师有医学训练，（不仅仅是针灸训练），那么他们造成严重不良反应的可能性很小 [13].
Risks Exist
Improperly performed acupuncture can cause fainting, local hematoma (due to bleeding from a punctured blood vessel), pneumothorax (punctured lung), convulsions, local infections, hepatitis B (from unsterile needles), bacterial endocarditis, contact dermatitis, and nerve damage. The herbs used by acupuncture practitioners are not regulated for safety, potency, or effectiveness. There is also risk that an acupuncturist whose approach to diagnosis is not based on scientific concepts will fail to diagnose a dangerous condition.
The adverse effects of acupuncture are probably related to the nature of the practitioner's training. A survey of 1,135 Norwegian physicians revealed 66 cases of infection, 25 cases of punctured lung, 31 cases of increased pain, and 80 other cases with complications. A parallel survey of 197 acupuncturists, who are more apt to see immediate complications, yielded 132 cases of fainting, 26 cases of increased pain, 8 cases of pneumothorax, and 45 other adverse results [12]. However, a 5-year study involving 76 acupuncturists at a Japanese medical facility tabulated only 64 adverse event reports (including 16 forgotten needles and 13 cases of transient low blood pressure) associated with 55,591 acupuncture treatments. No serious complications were reported. The researchers concluded that serious adverse reactions are uncommon among acupuncturists who are medically trained [13].
最近, 英国针灸协会的成员参与了二项涉及到66,000个针灸治疗的研究。他们报告并发症很少，而且没有严重的并发症。[14,15] 同一杂志的另一个文章说，对于一个称职的针灸师来说，并发症会很低。[16]. 因为没法获得能做结论的数据,所以也无法对针灸的好处和坏处的平衡作比较。另外，用中医的方法诊断病人所产生的误诊的可能性和延误治疗的可能性也没有从这些临床实验中被分离出来。
More recently, members of the British Acupuncture Council who participated in two prospective studies have reported low complication rates and no serious complications among patients who underwent a total of more than 66,000 treatments[ 14,15]. An accompany editorial suggests that in competent hands, the likelihood of complications is small [16]. Since outcome data are not available, the studies cannot compare the balance of risks vs benefit. Nor do the studies take into account the likelihood of misdiagnosis (and failure to seek appropriate medical care) by practitioners who use traditional Chinese methods.
可疑的标准
1971 年，因为美国的显要人物访问中国带回来的故事，针灸在美国热起来。与医学有关的和无关的企业家开始使用炫耀的广告促进临床应用，演讲会，示范，书籍，通信（网络）课程和教自己做的设备来推广针灸。 今天有些州开始限制针灸的使用，仅限于已经有美国医生执照的医生，或要求针灸师在执照医生的直接监督之下操作。美国大约有 20 个州容许没有现代医学训练的，没有医生监督的针灸师从事这个工作。FDA食品药物管理局现在将针灸针分类为2类医疗设备，要求标明只能一次性使用。并且只能是有针灸师执照的人才能用[17]. 美国老人国家医疗保险Medicare不付费给针灸治疗。 美国整脊椎学会1998 年3月期刊刊载文章鼓励整脊医师得到针灸训练，这样会拓宽他们的服务内容 [18].
Questionable Standards
In 1971, an acupuncture boom occurred in the United States because of stories about visits to China by various American dignitaries. Entrepreneurs, both medical and nonmedical, began using flamboyant advertising techniques to promote clinics, seminars, demonstrations, books, correspondence courses, and do-it-yourself kits. Today some states restrict the practice of acupuncture to physicians or others operating under their direct supervision. In about 20 states, people who lack medical training can perform acupuncture without medical supervision. The FDA now classifies acupuncture needles as Class II medical devices and requires labeling for one-time use by practitioners who are legally authorized to use them [17]. Acupuncture is not covered under Medicare. The March 1998 issue of the Journal of the American Chiropractic Association carried a five-part cover story encouraging chiropractors to get acupuncture training, which, according to one contributor, would enable them to broaden the scope of their practice [18].
美国针灸和东方医学全国许可证书委员会 (NCCAOM) 已经自动地设定了针灸师许可证书标准，而且已经发给好几千个针灸师许可证书。（注：certification许可证书，license执照，二者不一样。）到了1998 年11月，美国32 州建立了针灸师执照法律, 其中29个州采用NCCAOM 考试（和审查）作为（他们认可的）全部或部份的教育, 训练，或考生条件。 还有3个州则要求更多的条件。 目前在美国，针灸师的分类有许可证针灸师，执照针灸师，硕士针灸师，医师针灸师，和东方医学医师。经管他们中有些人通过证书获得了合法性，但是这些证书并不意味着他们有能力对疾病作出正确的诊断和给予适当的治疗。
The National Certification Commission for Acupuncture and Oriental Medicine (NCCAOM) has set voluntary certification standards and certified several thousand practitioners. By November 1998, 32 states had licensing laws, with 29 of them using NCCAOM examination as all or part of their educational, training, or examination requirement, and three with additional eligibility criteria. The credentials used by acupuncturists include C.A. (certified acupuncturist), Lic. Ac. (licensed acupuncturist), M.A. (master acupuncturist), Dip. Ac. (diplomate of acupuncture), and O.M.D. (doctor of Oriental medicine). Some of these have legal significance, but they do not signify that the holder is competent to make adequate diagnoses or render appropriate treatment.
1990 年，美国教育部承认针灸和东方医学认证委员会可以作为认证机构。 然而，这个承认并不是基于如他们自己宣称的科学有效性为基础，而是塞进了其他的标准。 [19]. Ulett 已经注意: （美国）针灸师的许可证是虚假的。他们中很少有几个人是（来美国以前的）本国的医生，而大部分没有学过医。这些人假装自己是医生并用针灸师许可证来掩盖非法的毫无科学根据的“治疗”。不幸的是，少数HMO保险公司，医院, 甚至一些医学院被他们诱骗（而付钱给针灸治疗）。以至于当他们的病人需要真正的医疗服务的时候，提供给这些病人的却是如此假的治疗。
In 1990, the U.S. Secretary of Education recognized what is now called the Accreditation Commission for Acupuncture and Oriental Medicine (ACAOM) as an accrediting agency. However, such recognition is not based on the scientific validity of what is taught but upon other criteria [19]. Ulett has noted: Certification of acupuncturists is a sham. While a few of those so accredited are native physicians, most are nonmedical persons who only play at being doctor and use this certification as an umbrella for a host of unproven New Age hokum treatments. Unfortunately, a few HMOs, hospitals, and even medical schools are succumbing to the bait and exposing patients to such bogus treatments when they need real medical care.
美国全国反健康事业欺诈造假协会结论:
针灸是一个没有证实的治疗方式。
它的理论和它的实施的根据是原始的和空想的有关健康和疾病的概念。它与现代科学知识没有关系。
过去的20年期间，针灸（在美国）的研究没有发现它对任何一种疾病有治疗效果。
针灸对病人起到的好转作用可能是由于好些个方面的共同作用的结果：（先入为主的）期待，暗示，抗焦虑，（文化）熏陶，和其它心理学作用。
针灸的使用应该被限制在适当的研究范围。
法律不要要求保险公司为针灸治疗付费。
未经医学训练的针灸医生的许可证应该被逐步淘汰。
想要试针灸的病人应该先向对针灸有所了解的有执照的医生咨询。要注意这些医生应当与针灸业没有生意关系 [20].（注：有执照的医生是指physician，不是指有针灸执照的针灸师。）
The National Council Against Health Fraud has concluded:
Acupuncture is an unproven modality of treatment.
Its theory and practice are based on primitive and fanciful concepts of health and disease that bear no relationship to present scientific knowledge
Research during the past 20 years has not demonstrated that acupuncture is effective against any disease.
Perceived effects of acupuncture are probably due to a combination of expectation, suggestion, counter-irritation, conditioning, and other psychologic mechanisms.
The use of acupuncture should be restricted to appropriate research settings,
Insurance companies should not be required by law to cover acupuncture treatment,
Licensure of lay acupuncturists should be phased out.
Consumers who wish to try acupuncture should discuss their situation with a knowledgeable physician who has no commercial interest [20].
NIH美国医疗健康（研究）院的悲剧
1997 年，由美国医疗健康院和一些其他的代理商赞助了一个共识发展会议。这个会议对针灸做出的结论是： “有充份的证据说明了针灸的价值。 针灸应当被拓展它的使用并进入常规（现代）医学，以及鼓励生理学和临床方面的进一步研究。"[21] 评审人员同时建议联邦政府和医疗保险公司支付更多的针灸治疗费用，让更多人能使用它。尽管 NCAHF 美国全国反健康事业欺诈造假协会的反对意见被公布以后的研究（都不看好针灸），但是评审人员并不采纳（这种研究结果）。 因此，这个结论只能说明评审人员有偏爱，因为选他们来开会的人大多都是针灸的倡议者。[22]. NCAHF 美国全国反健康事业欺诈造假协会执行委员会主席 Wallace Sampson 医学博士认为这个会议的结论是 "一群针灸鼓吹者的共识，而不是一个令人信服的科学观点的共识 ."
尽管这个会议提到了针灸的一些严重问题，但是并没有提请大家给与足够的注意。评审人员只是说到“绝大多数针灸研究报告是个案病例，系列病例，和干预性研究。这些研究的设计不足以说明针灸的（好的）效果。会议也承认“高质量有对照的研究很少。”但是他们说 “世界卫生组织已经列出超过 40种疾病状况作为针灸实施的指证。”我们认为世界卫生组织应当加一句，“证据尚不充分。”
The NIH Debacle
In 1997, a Consensus Development Conference sponsored by the National Institutes of Health and several other agencies concluded that "there is sufficient evidence . . . of acupuncture's value to expand its use into conventional medicine and to encourage further studies of its physiology and clinical value." [21] The panelists also suggested that the federal government and insurance companies expand coverage of acupuncture so more people can have access to it. These conclusions were not based on research done after NCAHF's position paper was published. Rather, they reflected the bias of the panelists who were selected by a planning committee dominated by acupuncture proponents [22]. NCAHF board chairman Wallace Sampson, M.D., has described the conference "a consensus of proponents, not a consensus of valid scientific opinion."
Although the report described some serious problems, it failed to place them into proper perspective. The panel acknowledged that "the vast majority of papers studying acupuncture consist of case reports, case series, or intervention studies with designs inadequate to assess efficacy" and that "relatively few" high-quality controlled trials have been published about acupuncture's effects. But it reported that "the World Health Organization has listed more than 40 [conditions] for which [acupuncture] may be indicated." This sentence should have been followed by a statement that the list was not valid.
更为严重的是, 尽管会议报告提到了中国针灸理论，但是它没有指出当针灸师（因为没有医学训练而）不能够先对病人作出正确诊断所造成的危险和经济损失。会议报告说，针灸的基本理论认为，人体内存在着不同形式的能量流，叫做“气”。气（的平衡）是健康所必需的。气若流通不畅就会产生疾病。 针灸师就是在皮肤的穴位上扎针，来纠正气的不平衡。
显然，针灸说的是整体论，（气）能量作用论，而不是以疾病为基础的诊断和治疗模式。
尽管对穴位已经做了很多解剖学和生理学研究，可是对什么是穴位，穴位有什么（解剖学的生理学的）特征仍有争议。更难的是怎样用科学来解释中医的一些主要理论概念，如气的流通，经络系统，和阴阳五行。 它们和现代生物医学知识完全不同，但是针灸师依然主要用这些概念来诊断和治疗病人。一句话，如果你要看一位中医，（首先是）他的诊断很可能不正确。
Far more serious, although the consensus report touched on Chinese acupuncture theory, it failed to point out the danger and economic waste involved in going to practitioners who can't make appropriate diagnoses. The report noted: The general theory of acupuncture is based on the premise that there are patterns of energy flow (Qi) through the body that are essential for health. Disruptions of this flow are believed to be responsible for disease. The acupuncturist can correct imbalances of flow at identifiable points close to the skin. Acupuncture focuses on a holistic, energy-based approach to the patient rather than a disease-oriented diagnostic and treatment model. Despite considerable efforts to understand the anatomy and physiology of the "acupuncture points," the definition and characterization of these points remains controversial. Even more elusive is the scientific basis of some of the key traditional Eastern medical concepts such as the circulation of Qi, the meridian system, and the five phases theory, which are difficult to reconcile with contemporary biomedical information but continue to play an important role in the evaluation of patients and the formulation of treatment in acupuncture.
Simply stated, this means that if you go to a practitioner who practices traditional Chinese medicine, you are unlikely to be properly diagnosed.
中医的诊断
1998 年，当一位有经验的中医在当地的一所大学演讲之后，他给我把了脉而且看了我的舌头。 他说我的脉膊表示 " 压力/紧张 "，我的舌头表示我有“瘀血”。几分钟之后，他检查了一个妇女，告诉她她的脉膊表示心室早搏。 他建议我们两人用针灸和草药治疗。每次的治疗费大约。 我也摸了那个妇女的脉膊，发现它完全正常。 我相信大多数没有（现代）医学训练的针灸师对疾病的诊断都有问题。 NIH美国医疗健康（研究）院的评审人员应该强调这一个问题的严重性。
Diagnostic Studies
In 1998, following his lecture at a local college, an experienced TCM practitioner diagnosed me by taking my pulse and looking at my tongue. He stated that my pulse showed signs of "stress" and that my tongue indicated I was suffering from "congestion of the blood." A few minutes later, he examined a woman and told her that her pulse showed premature ventricular contractions (a disturbance of the heart's rhythm that could be harmless or significant, depending on whether the individual has underlying heart disease). He suggested that both of us undergo treatment with acupuncture and herbs—which would have cost about per visit. I took the woman's pulse and found that it was completely normal. I believe that the majority of nonmedical acupuncturists rely on improper diagnostic procedures. The NIH consensus panel should have emphasized the seriousness of this problem.
2001 年的一篇文章揭露了中医的荒谬。 一位患有慢性腰背痛的40岁的妇女在二个星期内看了七位针灸师。 其中6 个针灸师诊断她是气淤，5个诊断她是血淤，2个诊断她是肾气虚，1个诊断她是阴虚，1个诊断她是肝气虚。针灸师提出的治疗方法更是一个和另一个不同，比如，有6个针灸师写下了他们（建议）在背，腿，手，脚的针灸穴位名，最少的用7根针，最多的用26根针；穴位最少的选4个，最多的选16个。在全部写下的 28个穴位中，只有 4个穴位(14%) 被两个或多于两个针灸师共选。 [23] 这个研究是用来观测一致性的。 所有被观测的针灸师都毕业于中医学院。想要志愿参加的针灸师中有6人被排除，因为他们的（诊断治疗）方法“非常不标准”；另外3 人也被排除，因为他们行医不到三年。这个发表的文章似乎是第一个用现代科学方法来研究中医师之间的诊断和治疗的一致性。 我猜如果研究的规模再大一些，就能证明中医的诊断方法是毫无意义的，对病人的疾病说明不了什么。而这篇文章的作者却说，几乎所有的针灸师都诊断了气血淤滞，所以作者认为结果是 " 相当一致 " 。 然而, 很可能所有的病人（无论他得了什么病）的诊断都叫气血淤滞。如果派一个健康的人去看多个针灸师，（他也被这些人诊断为气血淤滞），那就露馅了。
A study published in 2001 illustrates the absurdity of TCM practices. A 40-year-old woman with chronic back pain who visited seven acupuncturists during a two-week period was diagnosed with "Qi stagnation" by 6 of them, "blood stagnation" by 5 , "kidney Qi deficiency" by 2, "yin deficiency" by 1, and "liver Qi deficiency" by 1. The proposed treatments varied even more. Among the six who recorded their recommendations, the practitioners planned to use between 7 and 26 needles inserted into 4 to 16 specific "acupuncture points" in the back, leg, hand, and foot. Of 28 acupuncture points selected, only 4 (14%) were prescribed by two or more acupuncturists. [23] The study appears to have been designed to make the results as consistent as possible. All of the acupuncturists had been trained at a school of traditional Chinese medicine (TCM). Six other volunteers were excluded because they "used highly atypical practices," and three were excluded because they had been in practice for less than three years. Whereas science-based methods are thoroughly studied to ensure that they are reliable, this appears to be the first published study that examines the consistency of TCM diagnosis or treatment. I would expect larger studies to show that TCM diagnoses are meaningless and have little or nothing to do with the patient's health status. The study's authors state that the diagnostic findings showed "considerable consistency" because nearly all of the practitioners found Qi or blood stagnation. However, the most likely explanation is that these are diagnosed in nearly everyone. It would be fascinating to see what would happen if a healthy person was examined by multiple acupuncturists.
更多的文献请看：
CSICOP 对中医和中国伪科学的调查
美国全国反健康事业欺诈造假协会 NCAHF 对针灸问题的声明
质问 Isadore Rosenfeld 医生的针灸报告
For Additional Information
CSICOP Investigation of TCM and Pseudoscience in China
NCAHF Position Paper on Acupuncture
Questioning Dr. Isadore Rosenfeld's Acupuncture Story
叁考文献
References
本文于 2004 年1月 29 日再版。
1．Skrabanek P. Acupuncture: Past, present, and future. In Stalker D, Glymour C, editors. Examining Holistic Medicine. Amherst, NY: Prometheus Books, 1985. 针灸的过去，现在和未来。
2．Kurtz P, Alcock J, and others. Testing psi claims in China: Visit by a CSICOP delegation. Skeptical Inquirer 12:364-375, 1988. 在中国测试psi。一个 CSICOP 代表团访问。
3．Melzack R, Katz J. Auriculotherapy fails to relieve chronic pain: A controlled crossover study. JAMA 251:10411043, 1984耳针无法减轻慢性疼痛: 一个对照研究。
4．Ter Reit G, Kleijnen J, Knipschild P. Acupuncture and chronic pain: A criteria-based meta-analysis. Clinical Epidemiology 43:1191-1199, 1990. 针灸和慢性疼痛: 以标准为基础的 meta-分析。
5．Ter Riet G, Kleijnen J, Knipschild P. A meta-analysis of studies into the effect of acupuncture on addiction. British Journal of General Practice 40:379-382, 1990. 对针灸治疗药瘾的meta分析。
6．Beyerstein BL, Sampson W. Traditional Medicine and Pseudoscience in China: A Report of the Second CSICOP Delegation (Part 1). Skeptical Inquirer 20(4):18-26, 1996. 中国的传统医学和伪科学: 第二个 CSICOP 代表团 (第 1 部份) 的报告.
7．American Medical Association Council on Scientific Affairs. Reports of the Council on Scientific Affairs of the American Medical Association, 1981. Chicago, 1982, The Association. 美国医学会科学委员会报告
8．Ulett GA. Acupuncture update 1984. Southern Medical Journal 78:233234, 1985. 针灸现状
9．Tang J-L, Zhan S-Y, Ernst E. Review of randomised controlled trials of traditional Chinese medicine. British Medical Journal 319:160-161, 1999. 中医治疗的随机对照研究
10．Streitberger K, Kleinhenz J. Introducing a placebo needle into acupuncture research. Lancet 352:364-365, 1998. 介绍针灸研究用的假针。
10．Streitberger K and others. Acupuncture compared to placebo-acupuncture for postoperative nausea and vomiting prophylaxis: A randomised placebo-controlled patient and observer blind trial. Anesthesia 59:142-149, 2004. 双盲法比较预防手术后恶心和呕吐的针灸与假针灸的效果
12．Norheim JA, Fennebe V. Adverse effects of acupuncture. Lancet 345:1576, 1995. 针灸的不良作用
13．Yamashita H and others. Adverse events related to acupuncture. JAMA 280:1563-1564, 1998. 针灸的不良作用
14．White A and others. Adverse events following acupuncture: Prospective surgery of 32,000 consultations with doctors and physiotherapists. BMJ 323:485-486, 2001. 针灸的不良作用
15．MacPherson H and others. York acupuncture safety study: Prospective survey of 24,000 treatments by traditional acupuncturists. BMJ 323:486-487, 2001. 2万4千个病例的针灸安全研究
16．Vincent C. The safety of acupuncture. BMJ 323:467-468, 2001. 针灸安全研究
17．Acupuncture needle status changed. FDA Talk Paper T96-21, April 1, 1996 针灸用针的新规范
18．Wells D. Think acu-practic: Acupuncture benefits for chiropractic. Journal of the American Chiropractic Association 35(3):10-13, 1998. 整脊师用针灸
19．Department of Education, Office of Postsecondary Education. Nationally Recognized Accrediting Agencies and Associations. Criteria and Procedures for Listing by the U.S. Secretary For Education and Current List. Washington, D.C., 1995, U.S. Department of Education.
20．Sampson W and others. Acupuncture: The position paper of the National Council Against Health Fraud. Clinical Journal of Pain 7:162-166, 1991. 美国全国反健康事业欺诈协会 NCAHF 对针灸问题的声明
20．Acupuncture. NIH Consensus Statement 15
5), November 3-5, 1997. NIH有关针灸的会议文件
21．Sampson W. On the National Institute of Drug Abuse Consensus Conference on Acupuncture. Scientific Review of Alternative Medicine 2(1):54-55, 1998. 美国全国药瘾会议有关针灸的文件
23．Kalauokalani D and others. Acupuncture for chronic low back pain: Diagnosis and treatment patterns among acupuncturists evaluating the same patient. Southern Medical Journal 94:486-492, 2001. 针灸治慢性腰痛。针灸师诊断和治疗的一致性。
This article was revised on January 29, 2004.
作者: armstrong001 时间: 2011-6-2 23:50
我就扎过一次针灸，所以印象颇为深刻，牙疼，各位猜猜这针扎哪里？手上，立马见效。
扎手上按照楼上引用的资料，那释放的止痛物质不是得运好远的路啊，怎么运呢？还那么准确地快递般地送达。。扎脖子上不是更近一点吗？
作者: tzj7315 时间: 2011-6-2 23:57 标题: 纯属探讨
纯属探讨，谢绝人身攻击。
首先，楼主观点“1、针灸不神奇，刺激细胞产生止痛物质。”楼主其实大大的错了，这本身就很神奇了。如果我们能激发自身产生克服病痛的物质，那就是减缓病痛的有效方法而且副作用较少。西药有吗？西药建立在解剖学和化学基础上，而恰恰我们对这些学科并没有达到彻底的认知，难道你没有认知的东西坚持为真理就是科学态度吗？
其次：“经脉、穴位纯扯淡。
显然，知道了针灸的效果原理。再想想穴位就知道有多可笑了。穴位的诞生无非是古人发现了有些特定的部位扎起来止痛效果更好。
有人说不认穴位你乱扎试试？乱扎肯定不行！要避开血管、神经、骨头，还必须是有经验的人来扎，但绝不是因为什么穴位。
经脉、穴位不是号称人体开关吗？什么这个穴位通胃、那个穴位主肝的。你到正规医院针灸的地方看看，都是哪痛针哪儿。没看头痛针脚的。可见所谓穴位纯是无稽之谈。”
一看就知道楼主的思维很不符合逻辑，我简单的问一句，为何我们的穴位跟身体其他地方的压、揉、灸....完全不同的感受，你能解释清楚吗？没解释清楚就否定，是什么逻辑呢。
作者: tzj7315 时间: 2011-6-3 00:01 标题: 探讨
继续：“英国《自然·神经科学》杂志刊登报告说，美国罗彻斯特大学等机构的研究人员通过动物实验发现了这一原理。他们对有一只爪子不舒服的实验鼠的相应膝盖部位进行约半小时的针灸，结果发现这会导致实验鼠机体释放一种名为腺苷的物质，这种物质具有天然的止痛效果，可以减轻实验鼠的疼痛。检测显示，针灸后相应部位腺苷的含量是针灸前的24倍以上。”
这就证明老祖先是多么伟大，没有解剖学和化学、检验学支撑下能发明这么简单易行的办法，多厉害啊！你现在发明种西药给我，吃下去只产生腺苷24倍，无毒无副作用，我就认为你牛B。
注意，是无毒无副作用。
作者: raiseyu 时间: 2011-6-3 00:12
地主来清场了，就问一个问题，知道面瘫吗？知道西医对面瘫无能为力吗？知道面瘫只有针灸能治吗？知道针灸也是以中医传统经络理论为基础的吗？仅仅这一点就可以证明中医的经络理论无可挑剔的完美！中医的抹黑者们，记住，中医不仅仅只有汤药，还有针、灸、刮痧、按跷、导引，不是你们举一些汤药有重金属、毒素之类的例子就可以轻易被抹杀的！
作者: raiseyu 时间: 2011-6-3 00:15
引用:
原帖由 tzj7315 于 2011-6-2 23:57 发表 
纯属探讨，谢绝人身攻击。
首先，楼主观点“1、针灸不神奇，刺激细胞产生止痛物质。”楼主其实大大的错了，这本身就很神奇了。如果我们能激发自身产生克服病痛的物质，那就是减缓病痛的有效方法而且副作用较少。西药 ...
额，这位朋友，上面的一大篇一大篇的文章不是我发的，我是先抛砖，看看能砸到谁，果然有人被砸到了，看他们怎么收场
作者: dwyqrm 时间: 2011-6-3 00:15 标题: 回复 6# armstrong001 的帖子
你说扎手止牙痛不神奇，扎脚也能，敲脑袋效果更好。
玩笑！
神经传递速度好像每秒数十米。
作者: citycamel 时间: 2011-6-3 00:29 标题: 回复 6# armstrong001 的帖子
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作者: ClutchBear 时间: 2011-6-3 00:29
引用:
原帖由 raiseyu 于 2011-6-3 00:12 发表
地主来清场了，就问一个问题，知道面瘫吗？知道西医对面瘫无能为力吗？知道面瘫只有针灸能治吗？知道针灸也是以中医传统经络理论为基础的吗？仅仅这一点就可以证明中医的经络理论无可挑剔的完美！中医的抹黑者们，记 ...
这种做法和tg五毛有啥区别吗？
就算针灸有用，也不能证明中医是好的啊。只能说中医中有部分是好的。
作者: citycamel 时间: 2011-6-3 00:32
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作者: dwyqrm 时间: 2011-6-3 00:36
9楼：“知道西医对面瘫无能为力吗？知道面瘫只有针灸能治吗？”
这个说得过了吧？
到百度百科中去看“面瘫”，很详细，不用粘贴了吧。
作者: raiseyu 时间: 2011-6-3 00:37
引用:
原帖由 armstrong001 于 2011-6-2 23:50 发表 [url=
我就扎过一次针灸，所以印象颇为深刻，牙疼，各位猜猜这针扎哪里？手上，立马见效。
扎手上按照楼上引用的资料，那释放的止痛物质不是得运好远的路啊，怎么运呢？还那么准确地快递般地送达。。扎脖子上不是更近一点 ...
牙痛的话基本上只要一针，左边牙痛扎右手合谷，右牙扎左手；合谷就在常说的虎口上。
作者: dwyqrm 时间: 2011-6-3 00:40
个人觉得：针灸对某些病症有辅助治疗效果。注意是“辅助”。
作者: dwyqrm 时间: 2011-6-3 00:46
我左边牙痛就扎左边合谷穴应该也管用吧？
我是男人，应该扎左手，是吧？
作者: citycamel 时间: 2011-6-3 00:59 标题: 回复 16# raiseyu 的帖子
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作者: armstrong001 时间: 2011-6-3 01:08
引用:
原帖由 citycamel 于 2011-6-3 00:29 发表 
如果你是正常的 你脚上如果扎了个钉子的话 你疼不疼 这个距离远不远呢 你能不能知道你脚上扎东西了呢 疼不疼都要你的中枢来感受的 中枢一麻痹 怎么弄你都不会疼了所谓你知道哪里疼 都是这个地方的神经传给了你的 ...
但当时我先挂的牙科的号，自然是“西医”了，那牙医给我的建议是---拔了。。。因为我当时实在是太疼了，都摁着腮帮子在地上打滚了，我就一个要求，别让我痛了。
能即时地打断牙神经对疼痛的传导，不使用针灸，还有别的什么办法？比如什么药物？麻药就算了，整过牙的应该都感受过，那麻药对牙疼的作用有木有？！
再有，你那中枢麻痹一说比较恐怖，感情我那中枢就管了牙疼了？别事儿不管了？那针扎得能准确地找到中枢里专管牙疼那块，不也是挺神奇的么？
作者: citycamel 时间: 2011-6-3 03:15 标题: 回复 20# armstrong001 的帖子
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作者: dczwww 时间: 2011-6-3 09:33
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作者: lkblade 时间: 2011-6-3 10:21
面瘫有自愈性，和感冒一样，发病机理不清楚，各种治疗手段效果不肯定。
作者: raiseyu 时间: 2011-6-3 11:12
引用:
原帖由 dwyqrm 于 2011-6-3 00:36 发表
9楼：“知道西医对面瘫无能为力吗？知道面瘫只有针灸能治吗？”
这个说得过了吧？
到百度百科中去看“面瘫”，很详细，不用粘贴了吧。
郑重的请问您，您自己去百度百科查看过“面瘫”吗？我看过了，里面谈到的治疗手段只有针灸，没谈到吃点西药，做点手术就可以痊愈的，感兴趣的朋友可以移步这里：http://baike.baidu.com/view/56445.htm
作者: nannv 时间: 2011-6-3 11:26 标题: 二楼说得好1！
作者: raiseyu 时间: 2011-6-3 11:33
引用:
原帖由 ClutchBear 于 2011-6-3 00:29 发表
就算针灸有用，也不能证明中医是好的啊。只能说中医中有部分是好的。
总算有了半句实话，针灸有用，就说明中医的经络理论是正确的，也就是说中医的基础理论是正确的，可是现实的问题是即使有坚实的理论基础也并不代表在实践的过程中不会有瑕疵出现，中医抹黑者们往往抓住这些“把柄”，宣扬中医无用论，叫嚣着要废除中医、废医存药，殊不知中医不仅仅只有汤药，而且，中药的配方不是死的，针对病患的病症不同，要活学活用，不是所谓的中成药就可以解决的，现在大多数学院派中医所用中药的手段就和西药一样，完全抹杀了老祖宗辨证施治的大前提。
作者: raiseyu 时间: 2011-6-3 11:53
引用:
原帖由 lkblade 于 2011-6-3 10:21 发表
面瘫有自愈性，和感冒一样，发病机理不清楚，各种治疗手段效果不肯定。
面瘫确实有自愈性，可是和感冒不一样，不是百分之百自愈，可以这么说，针灸可以百分之百地治好面瘫。
西医称面瘫为面部神经瘫痪，为什么会瘫痪的，他们说不知道；中医认为面瘫的致病机理主要是寒邪侵入面部、脉络空虚导致，有些地方称面瘫为“吹了鬼风”，所以在感受空调清凉的同时请不要直面冷空气，特别是在睡觉的时候，很容易导致面瘫。
[ 本帖最后由 raiseyu 于 2011-6-3 12:17 编辑 ]
作者: raiseyu 时间: 2011-6-3 12:04
引用:
原帖由 citycamel 于 2011-6-3 00:59 发表 但为什么美国要求一定要在医师指导下 主要就是害怕掩盖病情了 ...
典型的方舟子逻辑，谁说美国的针灸师要在医师的指导下，真是可笑！
作者: adult_1 时间: 2011-6-3 12:42
“针灸有用，就说明中医的经络理论是正确的，也就是说中医的基础理论是正确的，”
又是自说自话的结论。
作者: raiseyu 时间: 2011-6-3 12:59
楼上的朋友，别断章取义行不行
作者: adult_1 时间: 2011-6-3 13:07
其实你的意思就是和你自己举例想要说明的一样，就是：现在只剩下了好的菜谱，但是呢，好厨子都没有了，所以做不出大菜。
作者: raiseyu 时间: 2011-6-3 13:18
引用:
原帖由 adult_1 于 2011-6-3 13:07 发表
其实你的意思就是和你自己举例想要说明的一样，就是：现在只剩下了好的菜谱，但是呢，好厨子都没有了，所以做不出大菜。
前半句我同意，后半句欠妥，好厨子还有，散落在民间，连行医执照都没有，中医学院里教书育人的、中医医院里治病救人的，都是打着中医旗号，做着西医勾当的利益为上者
作者: dwyqrm 时间: 2011-6-3 14:02 标题: 回复 24# raiseyu 的帖子
您老说话咋老是那么绝对呢？
仔细看百度百科中归于治疗面瘫的典型病例:
以下转帖自《百度百科》：
病例1
患者男性，60岁。因生气后突然双眼闭合不全，伴头晕、言语欠流利，无头痛及二便障碍。查体：内科系统未见异常。双侧周围性面瘫，四肢腱反射活跃，左指鼻试验欠准，右巴彬斯基征阳性。血、尿常规、肝功、血糖、血沉均正常，心电图示，多发性房性期前收缩、左前分支传导阻滞。头部CT扫描：未见异常。头部磁共振（MRI）检查：T1 加权象见双侧桥脑基底部有低信号，T2加权象则呈高信号，诊断为双侧桥脑梗塞。经用神经细胞活化剂、血管扩张剂、抗血小板凝聚等药物治疗1个月，症状体征好转出院。
病例2
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是不？没有给中医抹黑。但是中医也要明白自己的局限。
作者: raiseyu 时间: 2011-6-3 14:24
你举的这个例子不合适，那是脑梗所体现的症状，不是单纯的面瘫，我所指的是西医诊断不出病因的那个面瘫
作者: adult_1 时间: 2011-6-3 17:18
引用:
原帖由 raiseyu 于 2011-6-3 13:18 发表 前半句我同意，后半句欠妥，好厨子还有，散落在民间，连行医执照都没有，中医学院里教书育人的、中医医院里治病救人的，都是打着中医旗号，做着西医勾当的利益为上者
你这个太自我安慰了，真要是民间有大师，在现在通讯这么发达的年代，早就出名了，不可能隐着了。可惜出了名的，都是骗子之流，说明根本就没有民间高手的存在，这个在武术界已经被证明过了，不要再自己意淫了。
反过来说，你非要说有大隐之人，而又不被我们所知，那就证明他根本不给人看病，那样的大隐又他妈的有什么意义呢，神一般的存在，但是只能膜拜，不能解决问题？
作者: citycamel 时间: 2011-6-3 17:22
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作者: adult_1 时间: 2011-6-3 17:24
古人的这个忌讳一直传承至今，看看器官捐献数量就知道了。
作者: citycamel 时间: 2011-6-3 17:27 标题: 回复 27# raiseyu 的帖子
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作者: citycamel 时间: 2011-6-3 17:28
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作者: armstrong001 时间: 2011-6-3 17:46
引用:
原帖由 citycamel 于 2011-6-3 03:15 发表 你一点基础知识没有啊。。。没有专管牙疼方面的 相当于一个公安局 各地派出所 你知道是你牙疼 只不过是你牙神经附近那派出所报告的 全身都有神经 牙那的神经丰富 为什么有的地方疼痛在哪感觉说不清 就是因为其神经不 ...
我一造房子的怎么会有这知识。。这不搞不清楚找答案不是。神经偶不清楚，钢筋我内行。
按照你这说法就是说只要是身上疼了，不管哪里，这手上一针扎下去就能全止了？至少能止个一会儿？扎腿上行不？
作者: citycamel 时间: 2011-6-3 18:21 标题: 回复 40# armstrong001 的帖子
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作者: armstrong001 时间: 2011-6-3 18:36
你说的这个我懂，压迫止痛，是有效果的，但对牙痛是没用的，大概离脑袋太近了。
我说下我当时自己的感觉，针扎在手的虎口那里，不痛，但是非常酸的感觉，就像手用力过度，肌肉很酸那种感觉，然后牙就不痛了，整个过程不会超过15秒，所以我觉得这应该是有道理的，不是瞎蒙，用西医的理论难以解释。
作者: citycamel 时间: 2011-6-3 18:57 标题: 回复 42# armstrong001 的帖子
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